[Kevin] (0:03 - 0:13)
Hey, welcome back to Nutrition for Noobs, Summer Shorts, and this is where we're having a few shorter episodes and just short and sweet and to the point. So Michelle, how are you doing?

[Michelle] (0:13 - 0:14)
I'm great, Kev.

[Kevin] (0:15 - 0:53)
Amazing. So something that we've talked about a lot on previous episodes, and you've helped me with actually a few times, is as I'm trying to move a little bit more plant-based, trying to adjust my recipes, and everyone knows about my Caesar salad recipe. I will not bring it up this episode, I promise, although I just did.

But figuring out how to substitute and how to use plant-based alternatives for some more common non-plant-based ingredients. So I'm wondering if you have any ideas on this.

[Michelle] (0:53 - 0:54)
I do.

[Kevin] (0:54 - 0:59)
Oh, thank goodness, because I was going to say, if you don't, this could be the shortest episode ever.

[Michelle] (0:59 - 1:07)
No, I have... I've just brought up here, I have a substitutions chart that I provide to my clients. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Kevin] (1:08 - 1:08)
Oh, excellent.

[Michelle] (1:09 - 1:21)
Yeah. So, I mean, there's tons of recipes out there where this isn't necessary, but sometimes you want to start to adapt recipes of things that you already love, or mom's recipe or grandma's recipe.

[Kevin] (1:21 - 1:22)
Comfort food.

[Michelle] (1:22 - 2:16)
Yeah, or just something that you saw that was really interesting, and then you thought, you know what? I can do that. Let me give you a substitution example.

We have this one family recipe for forgotten cookies, and it's like a staple. It's called forgotten cookies. It's a staple in our home at Christmastime, and its main ingredient of forgotten cookies is egg whites, because basically the concept is you put your egg whites and your chocolate chips and your sugar and everything in there, and it makes a really pasty, gelatinous kind of substance when you whip it really, really hard, right?

And then you can just scoop it and put it on... If you heat the oven ahead of time, and then you scoop these on a baking sheet, and you put them in the oven, and you turn the oven off, you can forget about them and walk away.

[Kevin] (2:17 - 2:17)
Yeah, they're like meringues.

[Michelle] (2:18 - 2:41)
Yeah, they're like meringues. So I was at my aunt's house one time, and she was making forgotten cookies, because I never knew how you made them, and I was like, how do you do this anyway? And she goes, oh, I said, I'm wondering if there's a way I can do this plant-based.

She goes, oh no, you can't, because you need egg whites. And then I was like, oh my gosh, I can totally do that. So I just...

[Kevin] (2:41 - 2:42)
Challenge accepted.

[Michelle] (2:42 - 3:02)
I just saved the aquafaba from a can of chickpeas and whipped it really, really hard, and put in the sugar and put in the plant-based chocolate chips. And I put them on a baking sheet, followed the same thing, and they turned out almost exactly the same.

[Kevin] (3:02 - 3:10)
Sorry, so hold on, you lost me there. So are you saying you're using the liquid from a can of chickpeas?

[Michelle] (3:10 - 3:12)
Yes. It's called aquafaba.

[Kevin] (3:13 - 3:18)
Aquafaba. Aquafaba. And that's simply the liquid in a can of chickpeas.

Like you're not pulling my leg.

[Michelle] (3:19 - 3:32)
Yeah, and you don't even need to use canned chickpeas. You can soak your own chickpeas, and then the stuff that you would drain off, it's like a gelatinous, like thickish sort of water.

[Kevin] (3:32 - 3:33)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Michelle] (3:33 - 3:46)
That is, and it's nutritionally beneficial, and it's like just has the same consistency as egg white. So yeah.

[Kevin] (3:46 - 3:51)
Wow. And it whips up sort of with the airiness, the same as an egg white or similar?

[Michelle] (3:52 - 4:14)
You have to whip it. So there's two things that I found. So let's say you do it the easy way and you use a can of chickpeas.

Right. You have to use fresh aquafaba. So like I've learned that I can't drain the chickpeas, put the aquafaba in the fridge, and then use that aquafaba the next day.

Yeah. It loses something.

[Kevin] (4:15 - 4:17)
That is so cool.

[Michelle] (4:17 - 4:23)
Yeah. It's really, really cool. Wow.

So anyway, that is even one of the substitutions I was going to talk about, but let's- Oh, okay.

[Kevin] (4:23 - 4:26)
I thought that could be like the highlight. That's incredible.

[Michelle] (4:26 - 4:26)
Yeah.

[Kevin] (4:26 - 4:28)
I found that incredible. Okay.

[Michelle] (4:28 - 4:36)
Sure. So, and I should probably be adding to this list because I've learned some things since I made this chart. Okay.

[Kevin] (4:36 - 4:37)
So anyway- You should add aquafaba to it.

[Michelle] (4:37 - 5:37)
Yeah. Right. So, well, let's start with egg substitutes then.

So we know that we can substitute aquafaba in things, but we have some specific measurements and this comes from, I did my other advanced plant-based nutrition certification from Cornell. This is actually a chart that they gave us. So in baking, one egg is equal to a quarter cup of silken tofu blended, a tablespoon of ground flax seed and water.

That's the most popular one that we learned about in nutrition school is a tablespoon of flax seed and three tablespoons of water. It's a great, easy substitution, but you do get a bit of a flaxseedy kind of note in there, but in certain applications, it doesn't matter. It's actually helpful.

And then you've got more fiber in there too. One half of a mashed banana, which I think you said you've used.

[Kevin] (5:37 - 5:39)
I've used that before.

[Michelle] (5:39 - 5:39)
Yeah.

[Kevin] (5:39 - 5:40)
And applesauce too, I've used.

[Michelle] (5:40 - 5:45)
A quarter cup of applesauce or, you know what, fun fact, you can use any pureed fruit.

[Kevin] (5:46 - 5:46)
Right.

[Michelle] (5:47 - 5:59)
One quarter cup of oats can be used in baking and a half a cup of unsweetened non-dairy yogurt can be used in baking.

[Kevin] (5:59 - 6:05)
I was going to say, I've used that too. I've used a non-dairy yogurt as well instead of egg.

[Michelle] (6:05 - 7:01)
Yeah. And I've also learned that you can use chia seeds. You can make a chia gel as an egg replacer in baking, and you use one part chia and nine parts water to make a chia gel.

And that would be another way that might be a little bit more palatable for some people than the flaxseed, depending upon what you're making, because you won't detect that seedy note. When you're cooking things, other things like veggie burgers, for example, one egg is equal to a quarter cup of mashed potato or sweet potato. Yeah.

One egg is equal to a quarter cup of cooked oats or two to three tablespoons of tomato paste or a half a cup of unsweetened dairy yogurt again for the win.

[Kevin] (7:01 - 7:01)
Right.

[Michelle] (7:01 - 7:09)
And to make scrambled eggs. Can you guess what my favorite is?

[Kevin] (7:11 - 7:14)
Scrambled eggs. No.

[Michelle] (7:14 - 7:15)
Tofu scramble.

[Kevin] (7:16 - 7:17)
Oh, tofu.

[Michelle] (7:17 - 7:17)
Of course. Yes.

[Kevin] (7:17 - 7:19)
You've mentioned that before. I think.

[Michelle] (7:19 - 7:24)
Yeah. Skillet cooked crumbled tofu with spices and vegetables is delicious.

[Kevin] (7:25 - 7:27)
Okay. Yes. Yes.

Yes. Yes.

[Michelle] (7:27 - 7:33)
Yes. Okay. Okay.

Let me see what else we hear. Dairy substitutes. I have to get short.

Ha.

[Kevin] (7:34 - 7:35)
Ha. Exactly.

[Michelle] (7:37 - 7:46)
So milk, equal portion of unsweetened almond, hemp, soy, hazelnut rice, or choose your favorite. Milk.

[Kevin] (7:46 - 7:47)
That seems pretty. Yeah.

[Michelle] (7:48 - 7:48)
Right.

[Kevin] (7:48 - 7:54)
Like milk and yogurt are pretty easy these days, I think, to find substitutions on the store shelves.

[Michelle] (7:54 - 8:10)
So a cream substitution, aquafaba, again, can be used as a cream substitution in a recipe. Soy milk, coconut are good plant milks for that. Or they actually now have coconut cream.

Cream.

[Kevin] (8:10 - 8:12)
Yes. You can actually use coconut cream.

[Michelle] (8:13 - 8:14)
And it's super, super cheap.

[Kevin] (8:14 - 8:16)
I love coconut cream so much.

[Michelle] (8:17 - 8:31)
Shopping hint for our listeners. If you go and get your coconut milk and your coconut cream in the international aisle instead of in the like the nutritional foods aisle, it's way less expensive.

[Kevin] (8:31 - 8:53)
Super cheaper. The only thing is I will warn our listeners, because I've done this, you do have to look at the label. Oh, for sure.

Because some brands of coconut milk especially are better than others. Of course. A few nasty ingredients that I personally don't want to have.

So you do have to look at labels a little bit. Just a little warning.

[Michelle] (8:54 - 8:58)
Correct. And when it makes a difference of, you know, 20 cents a can or whatever, like, who cares?

[Kevin] (8:59 - 9:02)
It's worth a slightly more expensive brand sometime.

[Michelle] (9:02 - 9:16)
And you can puree tofu as a cream substitute in a recipe or soaked. You can soak cashews and blend them and they will provide some texture. A cheese substitute, nutritional yeast.

[Kevin] (9:17 - 9:17)
Yay!

[Michelle] (9:18 - 9:44)
Soaked and blended cashews again, but also almonds. Okay. Because almond, I have seen almond cheeses, pureed tofu, miso.

And there are so many cheese, plant-based, nut-based cheese alternatives. I don't love the rice cheese substitutes. I think they taste like vomit personally.

Anyway.

[Kevin] (9:46 - 9:49)
Don't hold back. Tell us how you really feel, Michelle.

[Michelle] (9:52 - 10:09)
Buttermilk provides a real stumper. If you're trying to make something and you're like, wow, what's the substitute for that? Well, you can combine one teaspoon of apple cider vinegar or lemon juice to one cup of non-dairy milk and it creates a buttermilk.

[Kevin] (10:10 - 10:28)
Okay. So it's the exact same way. Because if you're cooking, I know I've done that before with like real milk.

If I need buttermilk with cow's milk, you do that as well. So it's basically the exact same method as making cow's buttermilk if you don't have it from the store. Just add a bit of vinegar.

[Michelle] (10:28 - 10:30)
Interesting. Yeah. Just eliminate the middle moo.

[Kevin] (10:30 - 10:33)
Same concept, I guess. Yeah. The middle moo.

[Michelle] (10:35 - 11:25)
Yogurt. Oh, there's tons and tons now of unsweetened non-dairy yogurts. What else we have?

Okay. So that's that. Oil substitutes is a big question because a lot of people who want to go whole food, plant-based, like pure, it's a no oil.

And also anybody that saw when I did that to eliminate the cramping I was experiencing, I also just sort of randomly dropped 20 pounds in about six weeks because it turned out that's how much oil I was using when I kept saying, I don't use much oil. Yeah, everybody says that. Anyway, sautéing with water, vegetable broth, or vinegar.

Sometimes there's really yummy vinegars that you can use too.

[Kevin] (11:25 - 11:25)
Yeah.

[Michelle] (11:26 - 11:53)
And I also use tamari. Yes. Yeah, tamari.

Yes. That's so good. So there's tons and tons of way.

And in terms of vegetable broth, you can get these awesome organic, they're like the tetra packs, shelf stable of vegetable broth. And we just keep a whole bunch of those in our pantry. Every once in a while I grab one and then we just keep one and I'm always sautéing with it.

[Kevin] (11:53 - 12:06)
It's funny. I actually found, I forget the brand name because I have no memory for that, but it's in my fridge right now. It's a little jar of like a vegetable broth paste.

[Michelle] (12:06 - 12:06)
Oh yeah.

[Kevin] (12:06 - 12:07)
We bought that.

[Michelle] (12:07 - 12:08)
Yeah. I liked that stuff.

[Kevin] (12:09 - 12:15)
And it's really good. And it's like a bouillon cube. Oh, and I just find with the paste, it's easier to measure out and it stays fresh.

[Michelle] (12:15 - 12:17)
And it's easier to mix in.

[Kevin] (12:18 - 12:18)
Yes.

[Michelle] (12:18 - 12:22)
You're not chasing the little cube with a wooden spoon trying to smash it.

[Kevin] (12:22 - 12:34)
Oh, exactly. Try to get all the little dry bits in. Oh, I hated that.

Because they don't have, I used to use, I love the bouillon liquids, but they don't make those for veggie.

[Michelle] (12:34 - 12:36)
Oh, I don't think I've used those. Yeah. Yeah.

[Kevin] (12:36 - 12:48)
Well, I mean for beef or chicken, but they don't make those liquids for veggie, unfortunately. But I found this paste and it's, I love it and it's an interesting flavor. So yeah.

Sorry. Just wanted to add that in.

[Michelle] (12:48 - 12:50)
No animals harmed in the manufacturing of that paste.

[Kevin] (12:50 - 12:52)
No, exactly. Perfect. I hope not.

[Michelle] (12:52 - 13:05)
So in baking, in terms of oil substitutes, well, let me tell you this. Oh, that's easy. Often I've just left it out and it hasn't made much difference to me.

[Kevin] (13:05 - 13:13)
Almost any slightly substantial liquid will work. So like bananas or again, applesauce is my go-to.

[Michelle] (13:14 - 13:20)
Well, you know, keep going. You've got those, those are on the list. What else?

What else? Unsweetened applesauce.

[Kevin] (13:20 - 13:26)
Yeah. Probably non-dairy milks would work or a little bit of yogurt, non-dairy yogurt would work.

[Michelle] (13:27 - 13:41)
Oh, well, yeah, you, you could, but those are not, but if they're already in the recipe, they're going to dilute it. But you had it, you nailed it already. Applesauce, pureed pumpkin, pureed bananas, date, date paste is delicious.

[Kevin] (13:41 - 13:47)
I made some just the other week. Just the other week. It's so good.

[Michelle] (13:47 - 14:00)
Yes. Yeah. And yes, they are higher in sugars.

I mean, I wouldn't sit there and like chow down on a thing of date paste, but it's also full of like minerals and like there's fiber, like so many things.

[Kevin] (14:00 - 14:14)
But you're replacing the oil. So generally you're not using a ton. If you're making muffins and there's like a half a cup of oil in the recipe, that's when you use applesauce or something because half a cup of applesauce is perfect.

[Michelle] (14:14 - 14:32)
When you substitute oil for oil with something like applesauce, banana, date paste, even though they are got sugars, you are replacing nine calories per gram with four calories per gram.

[Kevin] (14:32 - 14:33)
Mm hmm. Yeah.

[Michelle] (14:33 - 14:34)
So like that's huge.

[Kevin] (14:34 - 14:39)
And just generally heart healthier and just even just like healthy, much healthier for your body.

[Michelle] (14:39 - 14:51)
Yeah. You're not clogging your arteries and veins. You're not raising your cholesterol, all kinds of things.

Okay. Lastly, meat substitutes, which I think we may have talked about some of these before in other ways.

[Kevin] (14:51 - 14:53)
I think in a protein episode. Yeah. Yeah.

[Michelle] (14:53 - 15:47)
So yeah. Legumes like beans, lentils, peas, like things that are high fiber and tempeh, which is made from fermented soybeans. It has a meaty texture that can be used in place of ground meat.

It's delicious in curries and chilies and stir fries and things like that. Tempeh is one of those things that I've had it in restaurants where it's done well and had it in restaurants where it's not done that well. Yeah.

Yeah. Tofu is always a great substitute for meat. And the portobello mushroom would be is great.

And we've often barbecued when we've gone to other people's homes for a barbecue, we've just brought portobello mushrooms and just put those on their grill while they were doing what they were doing. And we made portobello mushroom burgers.

[Kevin] (15:48 - 15:48)
Yeah.

[Michelle] (15:48 - 16:52)
It's delicious. Absolutely delicious. I just want to touch on the amount of fiber that you can get from also some very common foods and that, you know, like I, we put like chia and flax in our smoothies and things like that.

And these can also be, you may have noticed that like that flaxseed meal and things like that, like as a substitute, what you're getting when you do this. So chia seeds have like 34.4 grams of fiber per hundred grams. Flax has 27.3, but it also has more lingon. And then, you know, in chilies, I substitute meat often, I don't think I mentioned this with quinoa, like I just put a little bit of quinoa in there. Now, the first time I did this, Kevin, I didn't really understand or really think through how quinoa was going to expand. And I put way too much quinoa in my slow cooker and it was like, like the lid was like cooking off of it.

[Kevin] (16:52 - 16:53)
Oh no.

[Michelle] (16:53 - 16:58)
I mean, so you don't need very much.

[Kevin] (16:58 - 17:01)
No, it expands a lot, it absorbs tons of water.

[Michelle] (17:02 - 17:55)
It's got seven grams per hundred grams and soy has 9.6 grams per hundred grams of fiber. What else did we mention in there? Did we mention figs?

We mentioned dates, but figs have 9.8 grams per kilogram and dry, like apples, these are dried apples and dried banana, but like, I'm sure it would be fairly similar even though, you know, with the water in it, 8.7 grams per hundred grams for apples and 9.9. So you're not only making your recipes healthier, but you're actually, like in terms of the absence of some of these pro-inflammatory, you know, more disease promoting foods, you're also increasing your fiber, which almost like so many North Americans are deficient in. So a lot of good news with these substitutes and people can just have fun with it.

[Kevin] (17:55 - 18:31)
Right. I'll just add on the list of meat substitutes, I'll just add TVP, textured vegetable protein, which is I think a form of tofu or soy, but again, it's available in just about any bulk store and it's so easy to throw into a chili or a spaghetti sauce or something anywhere you use ground beef. It absorbs some of the flavor and moisture from the sauce and it's almost, I add a little bit of nutritional yeast for that umaminess and you basically can't tell the difference.

[Michelle] (18:31 - 18:40)
So I'll be honest with you, I've had TVP many times at restaurants, but I've never purchased it in a store and tried to make it. So what does it look like when you're buying it?

[Kevin] (18:40 - 19:05)
It looks like mouse droppings. Like it looks like dried, no, it's medium brown, little tiny kernels, a couple of millimeters across. You just buy a bag of it and you basically sprinkle it in to your sauce.

You make your sauce, you sprinkle it in, it will again, it will absorb some of the liquid. So just watch the amount of liquid you might want.

[Michelle] (19:05 - 19:08)
Matured vegetable protein. That makes sense.

[Kevin] (19:08 - 19:08)
Protein.

[Michelle] (19:09 - 19:09)
Yeah.

[Kevin] (19:09 - 19:35)
And it adds that meaty kind of texture, that ground meaty texture. It doesn't add very much flavor. So you do, that's why I like adding the nutritional yeast as well, just to give it some of that meatiness.

Look at you. Umami. But yeah, TVP is, I kind of call it like the plant-based, the gateway drug because it's so easy to incorporate.

[Michelle] (19:36 - 19:46)
It does sound super easy. I am totally going to try that. You know what would be so fun, Kavis?

We've got to go do like a cooking class together sometime. That would be so fun.

[Kevin] (19:47 - 19:49)
Absolutely done. Okay. Done.

[Michelle] (19:50 - 19:50)
Wishlist.

[Kevin] (19:50 - 19:59)
Okay. Epic 50. Yes, exactly.

Yeah. Yes. Yes.

Okay. Well, thank you, Michelle. This has been super helpful knowing, and I've learned a ton.

[Michelle] (19:59 - 20:02)
It has. It's been super fun chatting about this.

[Kevin] (20:02 - 20:08)
Yes. Yes, exactly. Okay.

It's time for my son's dad jokes.

[Michelle] (20:08 - 20:08)
Yay.

[Kevin] (20:08 - 20:11)
So would these be kid jokes, I guess?

[Michelle] (20:11 - 20:14)
I'm so much happier that they're coming from your son.

[Kevin] (20:15 - 20:26)
It's his take on dad jokes because he knows that I'm Mr. Dad Jokes. And I said, oh my God, I need to save all these for the podcast. And he's going, yeah, can I tell them?

So we might have to have a guest appearance at some point.

[Michelle] (20:26 - 20:29)
Oh my gosh. I would love that so much.

[Kevin] (20:29 - 20:32)
But he's at school right now. So you'll have to stick with me.

[Michelle] (20:32 - 20:33)
Okay. You're stuck with us.

[Kevin] (20:34 - 20:39)
Michelle. Yes. Why can't dinosaurs clap their hands?

[Michelle] (20:39 - 20:43)
Oh, Kevin, why can't dinosaurs clap their hands?

[Kevin] (20:43 - 20:45)
Because they're extinct, silly.

[Michelle] (20:45 - 20:55)
Oh my God. Oh, that's funny. That is funny.

I like that one.

[Kevin] (20:55 - 21:00)
I think that's my absolute favorite of all the ones he came up with.

[Michelle] (21:00 - 21:01)
I want that on a t-shirt.

[Kevin] (21:06 - 22:24)
Done. I'll get that. I'll custom make that for you on a t-shirt just for you.

Okay. Well, thank you, Michelle, for another successful summer short. And until next time, eat your greens and be real.

This has been Nutrition for Noobs. We hope you're a bit more enlightened about how your fantastic and complicated body works with the food you put into it. If you have a question or a topic you'd like Michelle to discuss, drop us a line at n4noobs at gmail.com.

That's the letter N, the number 4, N-O-O-B-S at gmail.com. If you haven't already, you can subscribe to the podcast on whatever your favorite platform might be. Also, please consider leaving a review or telling your friends.

That's the best way to spread the word. We'll see you next time with another interesting topic. The views and opinions expressed on Nutrition for Noobs are those of the hosts.

It is not intended to be a substitute for medical, nutritional, or health advice. Listeners should seek a personal consultation with a qualified practitioner if they have any concerns or before commencing any actions mentioned in the podcast.