[Kevin]
Hey everyone, so this is Kevin in the editing booth. If you haven't heard our episode from two weeks ago, I recommend that you probably go back and start with that one. So in that episode, we had a very special guest, Maria from Mayanna, and we can now refer to her as the cacao queen.

And we started our conversation in the last episode. And so this episode is a continuation of that conversation. And with this episode, we start to pick up with Michelle talking about the nutrition of cacao.

[Michelle]
I want to nerd out for a second. Can you guys indulge me? Because like, I'm just bursting at the seams.

I'm so excited at the health benefits stuff.

[Kevin]
That's what we're here for.

[Michelle]
So you can nerd out, Michelle. So if you were wondering, is drinking chocolate healthy? Like to the tune of what Maria was saying, like a jug of it a day or whatever, or several bowls of it?

Well, maybe. Absolutely, yes. In the quantity?

Okay, then we may have some question if we're drinking like 64 liters of it or something. But cacao and good quality dark chocolate lowers blood pressure, improves blood flow to the brain and the heart. This ability for it to do these things.

This helps to lower diabetes risk, lower cardiovascular disease risk. And it does this through the polyphenolic compounds actually help to increase nitric oxide in the blood. So anyone that has ever heard me talk about the benefits of whole food plant-based diet, one of the things about increasing extra plants in your diet is your body's ability to produce this nitric oxide.

And nitric oxide is what makes for really smooth blood flow. And it helps to prevent the clogging of arteries and the plaque buildup in your arteries and veins. Because arteries and veins travel everywhere, every organ system in our brain.

And even in that one very critical organ that only a male has. So, I mean, the fact that chocolate helps to boost nitric oxide like that is just opens it up to a host full of protective abilities, including the disease process for many mental declines are the same as they are for cardiovascular disease and in diabetes, because they have to do with this, you know, blood flow restriction being the heart of the problem. But so this can lower your risk of dementias.

It also lowers LDL cholesterol or, you know, what we call the bad cholesterol. So and then we've got also these beautiful flavonoids, not flavonoids, but flavonoids. So a different one specific class of polyphenols or antioxidant compounds.

And there happen to be the same ones that are very prevalent in tea. So we're talking about the catechins and things like that. And this helps to reduce inflammation, helps to increase mood.

So the combination of flavonoids and caffeine, the same as combining those two things, you plant when we're drinking it are just producing this host of goodness throughout our body. I mentioned enhancing brain function. Maria mentioned serotonin.

So serotonin and tryptophan are our amino acids. Right. So, you know, they actually help to produce these mood elevating qualities when when we're drinking something or eating a food that contains that.

So serotonin, you know, is always really key in medications that they produce for depression, et cetera. So, you know, you don't you why don't you just eat really good chocolate and drink really good chocolate.

[Kevin]
Exactly. There you go.

[Michelle]
And have a tea with that. So this like the performance enhancing aspects of having these flavanols and nitric oxide boosted in your body. So it can it can help with athletic performance.

So there's there's so many studies around all of these things. It's a little bit mind boggling. But, you know, it goes to show how this became tradition because it's kind of the same way people discover tea like the Aztecs without having the ability to do, you know, analysis on the plant and on the on the product.

They knew that something magical happened when I drank this. I knew that they that they felt different in some way. And I think that's probably why the actual name of the plant itself came to be, you know, literally translated as as what did you what did you say it was?

Yes. The food of the gods, the food of the gods. Right.

And and and I understand, too, Maria, that, you know, just kind of going back to that spiritual side for a second, I read in one of the studies in the in the intro to the study, they described that the Aztecs believed that the seeds of the cacao were gifts of a particular god of wisdom. And that's how they came to be. Yeah, that's that's what they believe to be their origin story, similar to how tea believes, you know, that there was a particular yellow emperor, you know, who discovered all of these things.

So anyway, so, yeah, we've got this nitric oxide. Let me tell you a little bit about how we kind of got to some of the more interesting literature about the goodness of cacao from a health perspective. So there was this so there was this Harvard professor named Norman Hollenberg from like Harvard Medical School, and he was really curious about whether he could find if he could find the people that had, you know, significant incidents of low blood pressure, low stroke, low heart disease, low dementia.

So this is starting to hearken to Blue Zones a bit for me. But this wasn't a Blue Zone, but he found this group of people off of the coast of Panama called the Kuna Indians. And so similar to where the Blue Zones and Alexander's Leafs research before that, that we talked about another episode, like looked for people who were homogeneous, didn't really leave their geographical area, that they kind of stayed in one place.

And and, you know, sort of the population was was mixed just amongst themselves and not a lot of outsiders. And he found that these these indigenous folks to that area, the Kuna Indians, met all of this criteria. They had almost almost no incidents of stroke, heart disease, Alzheimer's, low blood pressure.

And then he did these studies on them to try to trying to isolate, you know, the gene and found out that there was no genetic correlation to this phenomena because there were people that had left the area and moved to the cities and adopted different ways of living. And they started to develop these Western diseases by changing their diets. So what then he tried to figure out, well, what is it that the Kuna Indians are doing?

And found out that it was because of this very ingrained culture of drinking chocolate among the Kuna Indians. And they routinely drank more than five cups of cacao per day. So that that that whole Harvard study blew open the doors and they did all of these other studies kind of jumping off of what Norman Hollenberg found.

And, you know, it's so interesting. They found that they had lower death rates as a result of that, of all of these Western diseases that are the top common causes of death globally elsewhere. There was a study later in France of over 1300 elderly people that found that it was the flavanols in in the cacao that is attributable to this decreased risk of dementia.

And this that it stimulates this nitric oxide production. Holland himself and a bunch of colleague researchers followed 1730 people who are 55 years of age and older and followed them for an entire six year period, Kevin, and found out that the decrease of blood flow to the brain precedes or contributes to dementia. And then they made so they made this correlation.

Oh, that's why they don't have any dementia. It's because of this this increased nitric oxide production, because now we know now we know the mechanism that causes that. So he followed these people and correlates it back to this research.

Then he did these so cool. Right. And then he did these other experiments with another group of people and who drank flavanol rich cacao and found that it increased their blood flow the same as it does in younger, healthier people.

So you can actually I guess one of the things that he said was. Let's say that you are an older person and you are experiencing this decrease in blood flow, you can simply start drinking cacao and it will return your blood flow to some extent to being more consistent with a younger person. So really super cool.

[Kevin]
Wow. I'm going to order me some cacao right now.

[Michelle]
No. Right.

[Kevin]
That sounds amazing.

[Michelle]
And then and then he was really apparently, you know, quite an ambassador to cacao and enthralled with this research and really makes the distinction in his study that we are talking about natural cacao, not chocolate that has been processed, have heavily processed and not had the cacao butter removed and replaced with dairy as is often often the case. They cheapen it in North American chocolate or industrial chocolate, I should say. It's not not just North America.

Well, I think we're talking about the natural stuff. Right. So you can't run out to the Hershey store, the M&M store in New York City, Times Square and load up and get these effects.

[Kevin]
Well, because I think they are like in sort of industrial, big chocolate, like sugar, big chocolate. I'm going to make that a thing.

[Maria]
But I think like that's how it's called.

[Kevin]
Is it really? Oh, OK. There's a big something for everything.

Yeah, exactly. Big. Anything big is bad.

But in big chocolate, I think like isn't sugar like one of the, if not the primary ingredient, like a Mars bar or whatever?

[Maria]
Yeah, sugar and vegetable oils. So basically and in the majority of cases for all this confectionery, because this is actually not chocolate, but it's confectionery chocolate where actually a lot of those candy bars, chocolate products are made for from compound chocolate, which is cocoa powder with palm oil or other oil. OK, that it's not cocoa powder, OK?

Yes. So flavor, texture, everything. It's it's going to be not as if it's real cocoa.

[Kevin]
Well, yeah, the texture is interesting because you mentioned that. So I got a someone who I won't say it was it was a wonderful thought, but someone gave me at the holiday season that just passed a gift basket. And it was a wonderful idea.

And thank you to that person. It was wonderful. But it included chocolates and they tasted like wax, like the texture was waxy.

And it was and I'm sure that they cost like, you know, a bundle like it wasn't Laura Secord or, you know, Hershey's. It was like a brand name, an upscale brand name. But it was waxy.

And it you know, whereas, you know, if I have chocolate, I'll buy like one of those bars that's, you know, 70 or 80 percent. And it's a different quality. And you can tell instantly.

[Maria]
Yeah, exactly. It's it's I think it's really hard to tell the difference. Well, one of the one of the factors that you can see, especially a chocolate bar that is made or a chocolate product that is made with high quality cacao, it's going to cost higher.

Yes, of course, it's going to be higher. But also there's a chocolate maker, it's the the the maker who is making the chocolate from scratch. So we are making the chocolate from the cacao bean.

Right. And our chocolatier is someone who is making chocolates, who is not starting from scratch, is melting chocolate couverture. All right.

Yes. So and there's qualities of chocolate couverture. And there's like, you know, commercial chocolate couverture, the most the more commercial brand of the brands.

But like, sure, you know, it's Cali Bowl. So they use this couverture, they melt it down and then put it into molds and make chocolate. OK, right.

And so there's you can see, oh, there's a local chocolate store and I'm going to go and support is that local. But yes, but it's possible that they are using commercial brands that big, mass produced chocolate, industrial chocolates of quality.

[Kevin]
Right, right. Because it's convenient for them. That's it's easy to ship them and all that.

There's a number of reasons why they do that. But it's still not the quality that you're using, for instance.

[Maria]
Yeah, no. And especially now that the prices of cacao went high this past year and like, I don't know, 600 percent higher prices for cacao. And so even in the specialty chocolate, I mean, chocolate makers are reducing the percentage of cacao in the products.

Or, yeah, are compromising quality, which is something that I didn't want to compromise the quality of my products. Instead, I increased the price of the of my products because I I had to pay like three times the price that I started to pay at the beginning of the last year. I'm paying.

[Michelle]
You get what you pay for, though, right?

[Maria]
Like, yeah, exactly. It's like that. So the farmers are asking for higher prices.

And I if I want to keep the quality of my chocolate, of my the chocolate I'm making, I have to pay the price. And as well, I think my customers in the first place came to me because of the quality and because of the authenticity. And I'm not going to compromise that if they think that they were not looking for a big company.

[Michelle]
Well, they deserve it. They deserve to make a good living wage. Right.

[Maria]
Well, yeah, that's definitely the like me as a chocolate maker. You know, that's my you know, the core one of the core values of my brand of what I'm what I'm doing. It's the farmer first, right?

The farmer first, because the farmer it's delivering great quality beans. And also the farmer is they are they are in love with the land. They appreciate the land.

They care for the land. And if I don't pay what they what is going to let them have a dignified livelihood for their what they are doing for their crops, then they just want to, you know, start as like many farmers going to for for other crops that pay more or right. Or they are going to start is not caring about the land and must produce.

There are problems with the forestation of land to plant the cow, just monocrops that destroyed environment, right? They land. And we don't want that.

We if we pay the price, farmers who are who are aware of how important it is to care for biodiversity and environment, then we are going to have good quality chocolate for generations to come. If not, we are contributing to the destruction of the environment, which is a problem in our crops.

[Michelle]
And we all have to be concerned about this. Like this, of course, this is again speaks to I had the same philosophy with my business, Maria, that people in the West should not be profiting at the expense of other of of other people who are laboring and doing the work to produce this beautiful plant. But we have to care about the consequences of what we pay for, what what what what we pay for at the register is having a global impact on the industries that produce those products.

And if we have to command higher quality products and be willing to pay for it in order to put a halt to this massive devastation, that that's a result of agriculture.

[Maria]
Exactly. So that's actually why the reason why the crisis of cacao and when when higher, it's because of years of investment from big chocolate in the main to applying countries for cocoa in West Africa to apply what it was low for several years. And and that is due to that.

There's no farmers don't have the investment for the farms to tend the farms. And so, yeah, global. Yeah.

And the environment is paying for for that, but also in the end, all of us, I mean, we keep consuming a cow that it's coming from people and that it hasn't been. And then we are contributing to continue that action. Everyone right on.

[Kevin]
Yeah, it it sounds a lot like cacao is going through what happened maybe about five or six years ago with coffee.

[Michelle]
Yeah.

[Kevin]
Where there was the exact same issue of, you know, monoculture. And big coffee artificially keeping the prices low and not paying farmers a sustainable wage. And a lot of that was basically reeducating consumers saying, hey, coffee is a tropical crop.

It requires a lot of effort. The farmers put in a lot of work to do this. And your one dollar cup of coffee at McDonald's is not sustainable.

Coffee should not cost a dollar or, you know, or whatever. Again, nothing against McDonald's. Well, a lot against McDonald's.

But and and and there's a lot of consumer education that needs to happen, I think, to understand, you know, quality does. Like, as Michelle said, you absolutely get what you pay for. And quality does cost money.

And and these are crops where you can tell the difference between good quality chocolate, you know, cacao and your local Mars bar, which is, you know, 90 percent sugar and palm oil. And, you know, has never seen a chocolate.

[Michelle]
And you know what? And for this and for the sake of a couple of like a few dollars and cents, why would you want to put that in your body, too? Like why?

[Kevin]
Well, it's and it should be quality over quantity. Like I'd rather have, you know, one if money's tight or whatever. I'd rather have one delicious, you know, drinkable cacao drink a week than one crappy chocolate bar a day.

You know, like, you know.

[Michelle]
OK, so, Kevin, the next time next time you get cranky on me, I am going to bring you some Mayanna cacao. Let me let me let me let me tell you this.

[Kevin]
When am I ever cranky?

[Michelle]
Well, let's go back to serotonin for a second, because let me tell you something really cool. And this is going to grab some of our listeners, I'm pretty sure. There is another substance in in chocolate that contributes to this mood enhancement.

It's not just the presence of these amino acids. There's actually a substance called anandamide, and it's a fatty substance. And it binds to receptors in the in the brain the same way that cannabinoids do.

Oh, from THC. So it produces elation and exhilaration that is very consistent with the way that I feel when I eat really good chocolate.

[Kevin]
I should I should try some chocolate instead of cannabis.

[Michelle]
But here's here's the thing. They think that this is actually it's this it's this this fatty substance that's helping to boost serotonin and create this elation that actually is why people who how do I say this? Women who are experiencing their moon time crave chocolate. Your serotonin naturally drops, you know, during menses, and that they think that that has a lot... I used to... Well, we learned, I think, in one of my trainings that this had to do with magnesium because that you were actually craving magnesium, but it's actually...

There's some sort of a trigger that you know that if you've had this experience before your brain remembers it, and then it goes, well, I know that I got more serotonin when I ate that delicious chocolate, why don't I get my species to go and look for that? So I think that's pretty cool.

[Kevin]
Yeah, totally.

[Michelle]
And do you want to know how much you need, though?

[Kevin]
How much?

[Michelle]
So they found that the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition had determined in one of their studies that you need one half of one ounce of dark chocolate in order to increase total antioxidant capacity within a really healthy range, reduce the oxidation of LDL cholesterol and all of this goodness, and take advantage of this mood-boosting stuff. So that is about...

[Kevin]
So basically a little bit.

[Michelle]
Well, I mean, that's all that you need for this to happen. Not much, yeah. Not much.

I mean, but as we know from...

[Kevin]
It's pretty powerful.

[Michelle]
From the Harvard studies, though, that you can drink five cups of it and you'll have all these long-term health benefits.

[Maria]
And a cup of my chocolate I recommend, it's about 16 to 20 grams per cup because it's two tablespoons of the powder, because it's powder, and it's about 16 to 20 grams per cup that you are having if you're having a good amount, a good serve in your cup. Yeah. So that's...

[Michelle]
Well, I challenge you to have just one bowl, Kev.

[Kevin]
So I have a question, though, about this, and I don't know who I'm going to ask, so I'll just ask it and whoever wants to answer can answer. So I do know... So I'm particularly sensitive to caffeine, and I have been trying to cut down.

I'm on decaf coffee now, blah, blah, blah. And I know that chocolate, cacao, has caffeine. And I heard once that, I don't remember the amount, but a small amount of cacao has almost the same amount of caffeine as a cup of coffee.

So can one of you talk about caffeine and how it interacts, and how much should I be having or not if I am trying to limit my caffeine intake?

[Michelle]
So I can speak to that just in terms of, again, this theme that I always bring back when things like this come up, that it's not about isolated single nutrients, it's we have to look at the whole food and how we metabolize it. So another nutrient that we haven't talked about yet in chocolate is there's another... So caffeine is what we call a methylxanthin compound.

[Kevin]
You might call it that. I won't. But you call it that.

[Michelle]
Gesundheit.

[Kevin]
No. Yeah, exactly.

[Michelle]
It's not the only methylxanthin, though, that's in cacao. And this is, again, very similar to the tea plant. There is theobromine.

[Kevin]
Oh, I knew him. I think I went to school with him. Theo.

Yeah, theobromine.

[Michelle]
Theo, that guy. So theobromine, it's a mood enhancement. It's also vasodilating, which means that it helps.

So you've got this going on. You've got the serotonin thing going on. You've got the polyphenolic compound thing going on.

And then you've also got the nitric oxide, good, healthy blood flow. And then you've also got this vasodilation helping to open up those vessels, like the airways where we breathe, so that you breathe deeper, you breathe more slowly, you take in more oxygen. So you've got all this stuff going on at the same time.

So I would suggest that while you're getting this caffeine effect that is going to help contribute to your alertness, you've got these other physiological effects going on that are keeping you calm and making you feel good and happy and not getting an it's more of a stimulant, but not an excitant the same way. Same with green tea.

[Maria]
Yes. So the cacao bean contains the two, it's called an alkaloid, right? So theobromine and caffeine are two alkaloids that are present in the cacao bean.

The main alkaloid is the theobromine, as Michelle was saying, theobromine has no stimulation effect on the central nervous system, like caffeine does. And its energy boosting is weaker and lasts longer than caffeine, but without the gene. And also, yes, and also theobromine is more enhancing and it's known as a stimulant vasodilator and it's also a diuretic.

[Kevin]
OK.

[Maria]
Yes. And so just to have an idea of the content of caffeine, so, for example, I have done the calculations because it's hard to say because it depends on the cacao content, let's say in a chocolate. Right.

But for example, in a cup of my drinking chocolate, which is an average of like 87% cacao, there are about 10 milligrams of caffeine compared to, let's say, a cup of real coffee contains about 95 milligrams of caffeine. So it's pretty low. It's really, it's really low.

But it's, you know, it's possible that if you are really sensitive to caffeine, like I mean, OK, very sensitive, it's possible that you may feel some effects. Not necessarily. I mean, it's I haven't heard of cases that have said, oh, I don't drink coffee because I'm sensitive to caffeine, but I can drink, I can and I cannot drink your chocolate either.

So I haven't heard of any case like that. I personally, I don't drink coffee because, yes, I get, right, so my cramps, but I can drink my mocha, which has 10% of cacao, I mean, of coffee. So the mocha elixir has 80% cacao and coffee, and I can drink it and I enjoy it because I love the flavor and the aroma of coffee, but, you know, I don't have any sensitivity.

I don't feel it from that, from drinking that.

[Kevin]
Yes, right. Well, 10, well, 10 milligrams, as I understand it, because I looked into this a long time ago, but I believe like a cup of decaf has about 10 milligrams. So it's not like decaf coffee has none and I'm fine with decaf.

So basically, it sounds like, you know, 80 or 85% cacao drinking chocolate has about the same caffeine amount, although different, you know, the theobromine and all that as like a decaf coffee, which is next to nothing, but it still has a little bit. So it sounds quite reasonable. Okay.

[Michelle]
And I wouldn't drink decaf coffee because it's impossible to extract one nutrient without it being at the expense of another. I would drink the chocolate or the tea.

[Kevin]
Well, I just love, I just love coffee. I love the smell of coffee. I love the taste of coffee, but I do want to cut down the caffeine.

[Michelle]
Well, that's fair. So why don't you just drink like drink one coffee and.

[Kevin]
Well, that's what I do. But I want to try. Honestly, I want to try the drinking chocolate with coffee.

I'm going to order some because that sounds like the best of both worlds.

[Michelle]
I see what Maria was talking about. It's about the modulating effect in the bloodstream. So you've got she's also added these adaptogenic herbs, right?

So the adaptogenic herbs are also going to contribute to how we metabolize because it's because nutrients travel, they travel together. Like you're going to absorb it into your gut and then your your gut's not going to say, OK, well, your caffeine, you go over here and you go like it's it's going to travel together in your bloodstream. So the thing with coffee is there is no other modulating nutrient going with it in the bloodstream.

The caffeine just goes straight into your bloodstream. I mean, there's other nutrients going in, but there's nothing else that modulates. Right.

So you get a spike and then and then it wears off. You you burn that caffeine and then it drops off and then you spike again and it drops off again. So coffee, it doesn't work the same way as it would if it's good quality cacao with all its cofactor nutrients.

And we haven't heavily processed it. And the same thing, the same thing with tea. But, you know, there's one other thing I wanted to mention.

The polyphenolic compounds are the antioxidant compounds. They're often the same ones that I've said that are in tea as in chocolate, but also red wine, Kevin.

[Kevin]
Yes, I've heard that tea, good quality dark chocolate and red wine are kind of the three things that people go to again and say, right, you know, these are really good.

[Michelle]
So the difference is, though, people are always trying to throw a red wine in that bucket. And I can say that I'm guilty of having been one of those people in the past going, oh, it's a health food.

[Kevin]
Me too. It's a health food. Yeah, drink up.

A nice Chianti.

[Michelle]
But the truth is, based on what we know from, you know, what we've talked about in terms of the risks of alcohol consumption, the alcohol pretty much negates all of the goodness that you're going to get from those.

[Kevin]
So we just have to stick to chocolate and tea. That's that's the lesson.

[Maria]
Yeah, well, theotamine as well. Also, it's like it has this effect, like if you have a strong dose, you kind of feel like certain like euphoria. Euphoria.

So, yeah, it's like it's I mean, if you are going to socialize, right, like, yeah, I think it's a good drink. It's stimulating. It's a good stimulating drink.

Fortunately, there is now more chocolate makers that are working, especially Cacao, and that are ethical brands and that are making very quality chocolate. We have great chocolate in Canada. And yeah, so there's now you can tell from their brands message, right, and that it's very quality chocolate and you're going to enjoy what's actually the natural flavors of cacao and what's actually very quality pure, just two ingredients, which is cacao sugar or three ingredients, which is the cacao, cacao butter.

And so mainly a good chocolate bar. It's going to have these ingredients coming from the cacao bean and sugar. My products are sugar free.

All of my products are sugar free, especially it's drinking chocolate. And but it also with 100% dark chocolate that I have, you can melt it down and around chocolate treats or you can bake with it. It's flavorful.

It's smooth. It's not as bitter as the cocoa powder you may have right from the grocery store. So yes, I think you will see the difference.

So then that's why I want to offer that. I want to offer the pure cacao, pure cacao. And then you will prepare your drink.

If you want to add some sweetener, then you add it to your taste and then all the ingredients. But what you're enjoying with chocolate is the pure cacao. Right.

Value. Yeah. Additional content.

I wanted to say also about the fat content in cacao, because I have seen customers when they see it, they say, how many calories is a cup of your chocolate? And it can be like 90 or 100 calories of chocolate. And I wanted to just mention that the cacao bean, the fat content in cacao bean is 50%.

Actually, the beans that I saw from Mexico, from Chiapas, it's a high content of fat, more than 50%, like almost 60% of fat. I don't need to add any extra cocoa butter in. I wouldn't do it anyway, I'm a purist.

But what I wanted to say is that cacao butter is mostly saturated fat, but this largely consists in stearic triglycerides, which have been shown to have no effect on blood cholesterol levels.

[Michelle]
So sorry, you said it's mostly triglycerides, did you say?

[Maria]
Yeah, yes, stearic triglycerides, which have been, studies have shown that they have no effect on the blood cholesterol level.

[Michelle]
Well, that's right, because all plants have some form of lipid profile, right? Like it's important to the integrity of the plant.

[Kevin]
So Maria, this has been amazing. Thank you for all the information. This has been great to have you as our inaugural guest.

[Maria]
Thank you so much. I'm so excited and so happy for the opportunity to share what I love. Thank you.

[Kevin]
Yeah, no, your passion comes through without a doubt.

[Michelle]
It really, really does. And you can taste it too.

[Kevin]
So if our listeners want to taste it, where can they go? If you can give some information about how they can find your amazing drinking chocolate.

[Maria]
Yes, so I have an online shop. My website is www.mayana.ca. And I have the shop, I ship within Canada and the US, and to the US. And I also work with cafes that serve my chocolate, because it's drinking chocolate.

So I have, now it's within Ontario, it's different. It is in Ontario. And there's also a couple of chocolate stores, one in Toronto, one in Ottawa, where they sell my products.

But yes, I am working on getting, working more with more coffees or cafes that serve my chocolate, because it's something that I want to have more accessible for people to enjoy a cup. And then if they like it, they will try to get the products to prepare at home. And I always tell people, you know, add it to your daily diet, because at Cacao, my products, at least I can tell that, be sure that if you add to your regularly, my products regularly, it will definitely contribute to your well-being.

You know, and especially, you know, it's not just about the nutrition and also, but I mean, I've been transparent about like, what's in my chocolate, right? But also like the ethics behind it. I work directly with the farmer.

I source directly the beans. The beans are high quality, and I source them directly with the farmer. So I pay top dollar to the farmer directly.

And I get these beans, then I process them in a way that I get delicious taste, a great taste, great taste, but also that we enjoy the benefits of the Cacao as a superfood. Yeah, I think I'm a solopreneur. I do my chocolate with small basic chocolate, small bag chocolate equipment, but with my two hands.

And most of the, a lot of the process is with my two hands. And so I, you know, I care of the quality of the chocolate. I'm very careful for my craft, for the process, what I do that I, as Michelle said, and I'm happy to hear that you can taste it.

[Kevin]
Yeah, no, it sounds, I certainly want to try it out and check it out.

[Michelle]
And I want to add, Maria has a wonderful offer for Nutrition for Noobs listeners. If they want to try this beautiful product, do you want to tell our listeners what you're offering, Maria?

[Maria]
Yes. So yeah, because I would love you to try it. And because I'm grateful that you have invited me here.

And the listeners, you can get a chance to purchase our products in my own shop. As I said, it's called WMI.ca. And you can get, use the code, there's a discount code at checkout. You can enter the code N4N10, so N4N10.

Well, I guess you, Kevin, are going to write it, right?

[Kevin]
Yeah, so I'll put everything in the show notes. But just to recap, that's Mayana, that's M-A-Y-A-N-A dot C-A. And the discount code, if you want to try out one of Maria's amazing products, which I'm going to do as soon as our recording session is over, is N4N10, N4N10.

And so go to her site, check it out. And all of her social links are there on her website and all the links to the cafes that she partners with. I notice you don't have anything in the east end of Toronto.

I'm a little offended, but you'll get there, I'm sure. I'll send you some suggestions.

[Maria]
Yeah.

[Kevin]
Yeah, I'll just start up a cafe.

[Maria]
Yeah, that's right. No, I mean, I wish, right? I wish to have a lot more places to partner with and having closer to our community.

And yeah, hopefully, you know, hopefully in the future, we get one or two cafes there in your area. That would be great.

[Michelle]
Well, there's another business for you, Kevin. The dad joke cafe.

[Kevin]
Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. But speaking of dad jokes, Maria, you've said that you've listened to our a few episodes, so you know what's coming next, don't you? Okay, so I've got two, one for each of you.

So I think the first one will be for Maria. Okay, Maria, why don't chocolates tell secrets?

[Maria]
Oh, no, why?

[Kevin]
They don't like to spill the beans. Okay, and Michelle, one for you, because I can't leave you out.

[Michelle]
I can't wait.

[Kevin]
Why don't chocolates ever argue?

[Michelle]
I don't know, Kevin, why don't chocolates ever argue?

[Kevin]
Because they always agree on the sweet spot. It's a sweet joke, so it's a little bit more big chocolate.

[Michelle]
That's not what he did there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Those are cute.

[Kevin]
Okay, well, thank you, Maria, once again for joining us. And I hope that our audience got some insight into the world of cacao.

[Michelle]
Yeah, thank you so much. That was so much information. Thank you so much.

[Kevin]
Thank you so much. And thanks to everyone for listening. And until next time, eat your greens.

[Michelle]
And be real, everyone, especially with your chocolate.

[Maria]
Eat cacao, eat cacao, the food of the gods.

[Kevin]
There's our new tagline. Excellent.

[Maria]
Love it.

[Kevin]
This has been Nutrition for Noobs. We hope you're a bit more enlightened about how your fantastic and complicated body works with the food you put into it. If you have a question or a topic you'd like Michelle to discuss, drop us a line at n4noobs@gmail.com.

That's the letter N, the number 4, N-O-O-B-S at gmail.com. If you haven't already, you can subscribe to the podcast on whatever your favourite platform might be. Also, please consider leaving a review or telling your friends.

That's the best way to spread the word. We'll see you next time with another interesting topic.